iodill8
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Post by iodill8 on Jun 2, 2014 18:52:55 GMT -5
Every version of the Bible is translated the same but with different wording. They use different words but it still means the same. And this is i'm as much of a Christian as you are. Just because we know his name (again, no offense. I respect everyone's opinion.) and we use a bit more fresh words, so kids get it too, we still believe in the same. Our bible is a bit more complicated than yours (from Watchtower, i learned what trinity really is. I don't think i want to write it down like this for you because the differences in our beliefs, so i'll just leave this open like this. And a few more things, like why the 1st WW started, how and since when Jesus is our king, and can we join him, and help him on ruling the earth.) Jehovah's Witnesses have a VERY different belief system than most other Protestants. I'm an Seventh Day Adventist, so I use the KJV. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2014 18:57:38 GMT -5
And this is i'm as much of a Christian as you are. Just because we know his name (again, no offense. I respect everyone's opinion.) and we use a bit more fresh words, so kids get it too, we still believe in the same. Our bible is a bit more complicated than yours (from Watchtower, i learned what trinity really is. I don't think i want to write it down like this for you because the differences in our beliefs, so i'll just leave this open like this. And a few more things, like why the 1st WW started, how and since when Jesus is our king, and can we join him, and help him on ruling the earth.) You are hearing yourself right now, right? You directly contradicted yourself. Come on Ati, think a little before you post, that's all I ask of you. Also I mean no disrespect to your religion or those who believe in it, just in case you misinterpreted the meaning of the above. How did i contradicted myself again? (not trying to start an argument. It's the time i can't think normally, and i will go to sleep soon.) And i do think before i post, i am just writing about what i believe. I respect your beliefs, and as it seems you do the same with me, so when i am talking about things like this, i am showing my real self. Or at least the part of what i am trying/training to be. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2014 18:59:22 GMT -5
And this is i'm as much of a Christian as you are. Just because we know his name (again, no offense. I respect everyone's opinion.) and we use a bit more fresh words, so kids get it too, we still believe in the same. Our bible is a bit more complicated than yours (from Watchtower, i learned what trinity really is. I don't think i want to write it down like this for you because the differences in our beliefs, so i'll just leave this open like this. And a few more things, like why the 1st WW started, how and since when Jesus is our king, and can we join him, and help him on ruling the earth.) Jehovah's Witnesses have a VERY different belief system than most other Protestants. I'm an Seventh Day Adventist, so I use the KJV. I don't really know what that means, because of, you know, what you said is English, and it may be called something other in Hungarian. And yes we do, but we still believe in the same thing. |
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Post by SoonDragon67 on Jun 2, 2014 19:02:45 GMT -5
Jehovah's Witnesses have a VERY different belief system than most other Protestants. And yes we do, but we still believe in the same thing.  |
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Post by wildknight on Jun 2, 2014 19:07:42 GMT -5
He did, in fact. I'm sorry my friend, but even a small bit of study will reveal this fact. NO other translation from the Greek anywhere, ever, secular or theistic, renders the Greek word "stauros" as a "torture stick." The word clearly means "cross" and we have literally thousands of ancient documents to confirm that. The Greek terms "Gehenna", "Sheol", etc which clearly refer to Hell have also had their meanings altered in the "New World Translation." Furthermore, in the Bible that has been known and accepted by the entire body of Christian believers since the first century A.D. has read John 1: 1 to say that "The Word Was God"... because that is exactly what it says in the Greek, very plainly. The New World Translation adds "a", making it "The Word was a God." There are many, many more manipulate translations. If you choose to believe them, that's your choice, but I'm studying Greek and took a series of intensive courses in Church History over the past two and a half years... those are absolutely alterations that are not consistent with historical Christian belief OR any literate translation of the Greek language. In the Bible that has been accepted since the first century A.D. by the vast majority of those professing to be Christians, Jesus declares himself to be God in numerous places throughout the Gospels. This is an essential belief of Christianity, which is why it is clearly expressed in the Creeds adopted by literally every single early Church Council. You are free to choose to believe whatever you want, but I am not required to pretend as if the claims of your church have historicity. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2014 19:07:51 GMT -5
And yes we do, but we still believe in the same thing. We believe in the same. God (what in my belief is only the rank of Jehova) has all the power, and has created us, and his son Jesus. Jesus sacrificed himself for us, so we no longer live in sin. The only thing we and "real Christians" aren't match to believe in is trinity. We don't believe in that, because the "Holy Spirit" is God(/Jehova)'s power. But this is in my belief, and if you believe this differently, i respect your belief. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2014 19:14:03 GMT -5
You are free to choose to believe whatever you want, but I am not required to pretend as if the claims of your church have historicity. I understand that, and all. And if i'll ever go into America and meet you will leave you alone, and you don't need to pretend that my "church have historicity". But don't mock my belief (i know you didn't do it. I'm just saying), as i don't mock yours. There are studies that shows that you're right, and there are studies that shows that i am right. Let's say that every belief is right until we know. And right now, only god knows what belief is right. But please don't ever say that this is "my church" because it's not. It's a belief. Your belief is a church. Mine's a belief. |
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WhoCares?
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Post by WhoCares? on Jun 2, 2014 19:23:47 GMT -5
You are free to choose to believe whatever you want, but I am not required to pretend as if the claims of your church have historicity. I understand that, and all. And if i'll ever go into America and meet you will leave you alone, and you don't need to pretend that my "church have historicity". But don't mock my belief (i know you didn't do it. I'm just saying), as i don't mock yours. There are studies that shows that you're right, and there are studies that shows that i am right. Let's say that every belief is right until we know. And right now, only god knows what belief is right. But please don't ever say that this is "my church" because it's not. It's a belief. Your belief is a church. Mine's a belief. The belief of Christians is not a church. A church is a group of Christians gathered to worship God. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2014 19:32:57 GMT -5
I understand that, and all. And if i'll ever go into America and meet you will leave you alone, and you don't need to pretend that my "church have historicity". But don't mock my belief (i know you didn't do it. I'm just saying), as i don't mock yours. There are studies that shows that you're right, and there are studies that shows that i am right. Let's say that every belief is right until we know. And right now, only god knows what belief is right. But please don't ever say that this is "my church" because it's not. It's a belief. Your belief is a church. Mine's a belief. The belief of Christians is not a church. A church is a group of Christians gathered to worship God. We still don't have a church. We have meetings every weekend, and we study bible (with books that help you understand it) at house once a week too. Because i'm still learning, two real Jehova's Witnesses come here once a week, and we study. I've been put through tests. Not like tests you get in school, but a (by "a" i mean one or more) bigger ranked Jehova's Witness comes here i think once in a year or so, and he came to test me. This is a big accomplishment in my belief. And there are only 4-5 bigger than this. One being, going from house to house to teach people. With the big hatred coming for my belief, it will be hard but as the bible says (sorry for not quoting the exact poem) "You have to work hard, to earn joy". "Working hard" here is the hatred, and "Joy" is teaching people itself. Because as you teach others, you learn. Not just new things, but old things from another perspective too. I can continue if you want, but i don't think you do. I find joy in even writing about it. |
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Post by wildknight on Jun 2, 2014 20:27:17 GMT -5
And right now, only god knows what belief is right. God left us his word so that we could understand what he wants us to understand. Your church (and yes, I will continue to use that term... see below) altered that word. Period. I challenge you to find any authoritative text on koine Greek that supports your church's interpretations the words I mentioned in my previous post. The word "church" has multiple meanings. For the past 500+ years, one of those meanings has been to describe an organized body of belief. Even before that, it was used to describe specific groups of believers. The New Testament makes frequent reference to "the church at <insert location>", and even references differences in practice from location to location. When the western ("Roman") and eastern ("Orthodox") bodies split in 1054 (or thereabouts), they used the term "church" to describe themselves, i.e. "The Roman Church" and "The Orthodox Church." Then again when the Reformation theologians broke away from the papists, the term "Church" is frequently used to describe the differing bodies, with no objection from anyone. So, yes, the Jehova's Witnesses are in fact your church. Why you object to the terminology, I have no idea. |
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Post by charliebucketsgranpa on Jun 2, 2014 21:27:31 GMT -5
I was raised in the church and for the most part of my life I've believed in Christianity. There was one point where I doubted a lot but eventually came around to wanting to do better in my belief. I joined a church in 2001 but didn't live very Christian-like from 2006ish through 2011. I rededicated in 2011 and have done better but obviously I still fail at times. I don't think Christianity is very complicated at all. I feel a lot of people try to complicate it but I think it comes down to this. 1. You believe that you have sinned. 2. You believe that Jesus came to earth, lived a sinless life, died, and resurrected. 3. You learn/read from the Bible a type of lifestyle that you should try to put some effort into living it. You will fail along the way but keep trying your best, be who you are, but at the same time try to abide by the rules of the Bible.
That may be extremely simplified but that's what I believe.
I rarely go to church though. As I've said before that may not be the best option but the reason is because I just feel the church has become very divided. This church says you must do this and that church says you must do that. Everybody seems to say something different when I don't think it's that complicated. I follow the KJV or NKJV version by the way. I also get real apprehensive around the "burn your def leppard albums" types of people. The Assistant Pastor of the church I joined (which is actually related to me) talks all the time about how "Christians who listen to rock music do things Christians shouldn't do." Pretty much a direct quote. I have nothing against the guy but I'm just not a big fan or share many of the same viewpoints on things as him.
The best option would probably be to try look for another church I feel more welcomed in and I do plan to do that and I need to get around to it. I'm not sure when I will though.
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WhoCares?
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Post by WhoCares? on Jun 2, 2014 21:34:26 GMT -5
I feel as though smaller churches are usually more welcoming. Everyone knows everyone, it really feels more like a family IMO.
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Post by Straight Edge Steve on Jun 2, 2014 21:37:34 GMT -5
I feel as though smaller churches are usually more welcoming. Everyone knows everyone, it really feels more like a family IMO. This. |
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Post by SoonDragon67 on Jun 2, 2014 21:38:13 GMT -5
I feel as though smaller churches are usually more welcoming. Everyone knows everyone, it really feels more like a family IMO. That isn't always true. |
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Post by wildknight on Jun 2, 2014 21:41:48 GMT -5
I feel as though smaller churches are usually more welcoming. Everyone knows everyone, it really feels more like a family IMO. This. That doesn't necessarily mean that they're teaching sound doctrine though. When Paul warns Timothy of the things he should be wary of in the future (2 Timothy 4, I believe), he doesn't say "and the time will come when churches will not be friendly places where everybody feels like they belong..." He says "time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions." You should be much more concerned over whether your church is teaching sound Biblical doctrine than with whether or not you like the person in the pew next to you. |
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Post by WhoCares? on Jun 2, 2014 21:42:35 GMT -5
I feel as though smaller churches are usually more welcoming. Everyone knows everyone, it really feels more like a family IMO. That isn't always true. Not always, heck, the church I'm a member of almost became divided after we learned that we were paying for the pastor's dry cleaning. |
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Post by wildknight on Jun 2, 2014 21:42:52 GMT -5
... that said, I do believe that Mega Churches are typically purveyors of false teaching that water down the word of God in exchange for attendance, money in the coffers, and the acceptance of the world at large.
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Post by Straight Edge Steve on Jun 2, 2014 21:43:10 GMT -5
That doesn't necessarily mean that they're teaching sound doctrine though. When Paul warns Timothy of the things he should be wary of in the future (2 Timothy 4, I believe), he doesn't say "and the time will come when churches will not be friendly places where everybody feels like they belong..." He says "time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions." You should be much more concerned over whether your church is teaching sound Biblical doctrine than with whether or not you like the person in the pew next to you. That's always the most important thing to take into account. If what they are saying isn't in the bible, then I'm going elsewhere. |
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Post by wildknight on Jun 2, 2014 21:43:19 GMT -5
Not always, heck, the church I'm a member of almost became divided after we learned that we were paying for the pastor's dry cleaning. Nothing at all unusual about that sort of thing. |
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Post by charliebucketsgranpa on Jun 2, 2014 21:44:29 GMT -5
Yea the church I was speaking of is actually a smaller church that for the most part does feel welcoming. I love the Pastor there and his wife they are great people. Most of the members are really caring and you can genuinely feel that. I just was so perturbed at some of the things that were preached by certain individuals there.
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